Issue No. 97 - Monday March 31, 2003
Moderated by: Thurmond Moore III
Committed to carrying on the fine works of
Hale Sweeny and Jerry Dewbre


From the Moderator: 

Topical Focus for This Week: Gemstone Photography Clinic

Here is an idea.  Members could research this topic in old digest
IFA, LAD, USFG, FD, Hale Sweeny's Lapidary Digest Archives and
compose a list of Issues and or URL's that are useful to the discussion
in addition to personal experiences.

Index to Today's Digest

01  RE:  Avoiding Subsurface Damage
02  NEW:  Wulfenite
03  RE:  Thin rough for sale issues
04  RE:  Thin rough for sale issues
05  RE:  Quartz
06  NEW:  Gemstones of Turkey
07  RE:  Polish / Quartz
08  NEW:  Time issues


Subject: To avoid subsurface damage article
Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2003 15:00:42 -0500
To: "'lapidary@caprock-spur.com'" <lapidary@caprock-spur.com>
From: "Winfield, Robert (NIH/NIMH)" <WinfielR@intra.nimh.nih.gov>


link to article on subsurface damage.
an 80 grit can damage anywhere from 1 to 2.4 mm.
imagine a sphere 10mm in diameter, up to a shell of 2.4mm all the way around
could vanish
all is explained in the article


>To avoid subsurface damage, after somewhat gross preforming on a cabbing machine,
>depending on the size of the stone I cut on a 325 or 600 lap, prepolish on either a well
>worn Nubond 600 or a steel 1200 and polish on a Dyna Lap cerium oxide lap.
>It's quick, easy, gives me sharp flat facets and a good polish.  It's probably not
>competition grade, but it beats most anything else.



Subject: Wulfenite
Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2003 15:20:42 -0500
To: <faceters@caprock-spur.com>
From: "Ron" <faceter01@hotmail.com>


I was wondering if anyone in the group has faceted Wulfenite before. Is
there anything special involved in it?
I have a clear, bright orange piece that would make a great faceted



Subject: thin rough issues
Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2003 12:16:20 -0800 (PST)
To: LapidaryArtsDigest <lapidary@caprock-spur.com>
From: Dave Thompson <djt@irastro.caltech.edu>

As a gedanken experiment, consider cutting identical SRBs
out of minimally-sized rough with initial shapes of a cube, cylinder,
sphere, and a preform.  Relative to the cube, the weights of the
initial rough would be: 1.00 (cube), 0.79 (cylinder), 0.52 (sphere),
and 0.36 (preform, estimated).  Rough can easily vary in weight by
over a factor of three and still cut the same stone, depending on
the initial shape.

I am sure that there are scams out there.  The point to
take from this is that you should only buy from reputable dealers
with a full return policy if you are at all worried.

Dave (Pasadena, CA).


Subject: Scam comments
Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2003 21:26:10 +0000
To: lapidary@caprock-spur.com
From: denney.wilson@att.net

     I was not trying to paint all dealers with the scam brush.   I know that
most dealers are honest and will accurately describe what they are selling.  If
a dealer lists all the dimensions of a piece of rough, I have no problems at
all.  If pictures are provided from several sides with only two measurements,
there is usually not a problem.  However, the problem comes when the dealers
are less than honest.  In those cases, my calculations give a good picture of
what you could expect.  Yes, the results might be a little low or high but they
also will not show that a piece of rough is wedge shaped (hence, yielding much
lower cut weights and sizes) or dished in the middle.  The main purpose is to
give the user the confidence to order or not from an unknown or new source.
     I agree that most good vendors have a return policy.   However, not all
return policies are alike.  Good vendors will allow a reasonable amount of time
(say a week plus anticipated shipping times (2 ways) or more) to inspect or
reject an order.  However, I have seen statements such as "Returns must be
recieved by us within 5 days of initial shipment." and even worse.  This would
require almost impossible means to get the material back to the vendor even if
you did not do an inspection!  However, with or without a good return policy,
it is wise to deal with new vendors cautiously if the calculations suggested
indicate material that may be just chips.  If you find that the vendor is
really doing a great job, continue buying. In any case, you will at least have
some indication that you are at risk and how bad that risk is.

Denney L. Wilson
Wilson Lapidary

Subject: Quartz
Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2003 17:14:13 -0500
To: lapidary@caprock-spur.com (LapidaryArtsDigest)
From: "Jonathan L. Rolfe" <webmaster@gearloose.com>

At 01:37 PM 3/28/2003 -0600, you wrote:
>When polishing quartz, I will
>sometimes see a trigon pattern emerge. The pattern appears as a series
>of triangles on a facet, but it is actually just below the surface and
>not upon the surface. Famous gem artisan, Lawrence Stoller also
>mentioned that he has seen this pattern when polishing quartz. He
>understands the pattern as an indication of obtaining a complete polish
>on a surface of quartz. Scott Wilson, who has polished telescope mirrors
>in the past, said that these were sub-surface indications of the quartz
>crystal structure.

They are packing faults.  Next time you see a quartz crystal (One that has
not been polished or ground to a cosmetic hexagon, such as the ones sold
for "healing" purposes), note that when viewing the sides of the crystal,
often every other face has this, or a checkered pattern of tetrahedrons or
pyramid-shaped  recesses.  So going around the outside of the crystal,
looking at the "A" and "B" (this convention does not really work with
quartz, but most people recognize it), than the sides would be called,
alternately as you go around the crystal, A,B,A,B,A, where all the "A"'s
would have good faces, and all the "B"'s would have checkered faces.
Here is another way of seeing what is going on:  Imagine filling a round
jar with marbles, or building a cube with bricks.  All sides would look
similar.  Now try building a hexagon with   bricks.  Some sides would come
out smooth, and some would not.


Subject: gemstones of Turkey
Date: Mon, 31 Mar 2003 12:10:15 +0300
To: <lapidary@caprock-spur.com>
From: "birdamlasu" <fob@birdamlasu.com>

Hello all,
I have finally completed the page for "gemstones of Turkey".
www.birdamlasu.com/mycountry     Click at "gemstones of Turkey"

Many people were very interested to know more about the Oltu stone. I
have worked this stone the first time in my life. I was very excited to
see the way it reacted to cutting and polishing. I identified it as jet.
I am sure in the States and many countries have this stone. In Erzurum
the jewellers are using it so much.

I also wanted to tell you that I am a woman. "Oya" means; the knotting
with fine silk tread that is done as embroidery around a scarve  or a
handckerchief. What a name it would be for a man... Please meet me and
my family in "my gallery" page.

Kind regards to all from Turkey,
Oya Borahan


Subject: Polish / Quartz
Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2003 18:50:13 -0800
From: "lidafr" <lidafr@attbi.com>
To: "Lapidary Arts and Faceters Digest" <faceters@caprock-spur.com>

The only miserable nasties that can really frustrate my quartz polishing
are tiny almost invisible crystal and fracture inclusions from heat
treating ( natural or man produced ) in citrine, smokey quartz, etc.
It's easier to misdiagnose and blame it on a lap or polishing
techmique..... So beware of your rough... It might be the



Subject: Time issues
Date: Mon, 31 Mar 2003 04:29:14 -0500
To: faceters@caprock-spur.com
From: "Douglas Turet" <anotherbrightidea@hotmail.com>

Hi all,

     Despite my best intentions (or perhaps, because of them), I now have so
many clients and much work on my desk that I doubt I'll have a truly "free"
minute anytime in the next three months! As such, if any of you have any
questions in need of answering or technical challenges in need of mentoring,
I'll only be able to share a few minutes of my time with you, carte blanche.
If the issues at hand require more than about five minutes to cover, my
standard rate of $75/hr. will apply. No hard feelings intended towards
anyone, but the paying clients always come first and, right now, there are
many of them. Thanks to all for understanding.


Douglas Turet, GJ
Lapidary Artist, Designer & Goldsmith.
Turet Design
P. O. Box 162
Arlington, MA 02476, U.S.A.
Tel. (617) 325-5328
Fax: (928) 222-0815
Email: anotherbrightidea@hotmail.com









PERSONALS: (General Lapidary and Faceting)




Lurking is fine, but participation is better for learning !
Post something from your experiences in gemcutting today!


Landing at a hidden military base
You've all heard of the Air Force's ultra-high-security,
super-secret base in Nevada, known simply as "Area 51?"

Well, late one afternoon, the Air Force folks out at Area 51
were very surprised to see a Cessna landing at their "secret"
base. They immediately impounded the aircraft and hauled the
pilot into an interrogation room.

The pilot's story was that he took off from Vegas, got lost, and
spotted the Base just as he was about to run out of fuel. The
Air Force started a full FBI background check on the pilot and
held him overnight during the investigation.

By the next day, they were finally convinced that the pilot really
was lost and wasn't a spy. They gassed up his airplane, gave
him a terrifying "you-did-not-see-a-base" briefing, complete with
threats of spending the rest of his life in prison, told him Vegas
was that-a-way on such-and-such a heading, and sent him on
his way.

The day after that though, to the total disbelief of the Air Force,
the same Cessna showed up again. Once again, the MP's
surrounded the plane...only this time there were two people in
the plane.

The same pilot jumped out and said, "Do anything you want to
me, but my wife is in the plane and you have to tell her where I
was last night!"



The greatest fool of all is the man who fools himself



From: "RICHARD P ROSENTHAL" <kenaii@earthlink.net>

I am looking for a primary source for  rough White Nephrite Jade, close
to point of origin, which is the Ho-Tien[ Hotan] or Yarkand area of
China. Contact Kenaii@earthlink.net I do have Carving and Gem grade
Green Nephrite Jade from Siberia for sale.


Get a FREE copy of the 2003 Faceter's Engagement Calendar
with a $100+ rough purchase at http://www.qualitygemrough.com
(see website for details).

We have recently added some new material, including a new African
find of green/yellow diopside (and we are the only people we know
who have it).  Our stock includes things like alexandrite, amethyst,
aquamarine, chrysoberyl, citrine, emerald, garnets (many varieties)
kornerupine, sapphire, spinel, tourmaline, zircon and more.

At http://www.qualitygemrough.com you get more value for your
money and we show our appreciation for your business with superior
customer service.  You always have a money back guarantee with
the 5-day inspection period, and the convenience of using your
Visa or Mastercard.


Rough to Cut
If you're looking for quality facet rough please check out Rough to Cut,
http://www.roughtocut.com. We offer a wide range of quality facet rough
from Aquamarine to Zircon. Large selections in stock currently of Beryl,
Garnets & Tourmalines. Please check us out & when you do, why not give a
try to our contest, you could win a 5ct + piece of Spessartite garnet
facet rough.

Rough to Cut


Contact b-daw@pacbell.net

Honey, red & brown zircons, 10g parcels @$20/parcel
Red Garnet $8/g, eye clean-slightly included
Spessartine Garnet $7.50/g, slight-moderately included
Malaya Garnet $6/g, good eye clean roughs
Tunduri Garnet $10/g, eye clean-slightly included
Pink Tourmaline $20/g, eye clean-slightly included
Red Tourmaline $10/g, slight-moderately included
Bicolor Tourmaline $15/g, eye clean
Watermelon Tourmaline $20/g eye clean
Green/Green Blue Tourmaline $10/g, eye clean roughs
Blue, Green & Blue/Green Sapphires $35/g, eye clean-slightly included, up to 1g.
Blue Beryl (Aquamarine) $6/g, eye clean-slightly included crystals
Green Beryl (Emerald) $10-$50/g, eye clean-slightly included crystals, zoned green
Cabbing Grade Aquamarine $3/g


Rock Peddler
Complete online discount catalog for cabbing and faceting machines, wheels,
laps, polishes, diamond saws, diamond blades, and general lapidary supplies
at http://www.rockpeddler.com.


Gewelers Gems
e-mail: sales@jewelersgems.com
Solid copper laps 1/4 thick 8" and 6"  you can charge both sides with
diamond. Other laps too !! http://www.jewelersgems.com

NOW ONLINE!  RRGaetan Gem Rough - Featuring excellent, facet-grade,
Colombian Emerald rough! PLUS, Chrome Tourmaline, Achroite Tourmaline,
Golden Chrome Tourmaline, Aquamarine, Spess, Mint and Malaya Garnets,
and more! For photos and more information, visit us at rrgaetan.com .



is produced by Thurmond Moore III

Tempie Francis, Attorney at Law / Legal Advisor

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