Issue No. 189 - Monday August 18, 2003
Moderated by: Thurmond Moore III
Committed to carrying on the fine works of
Hale Sweeny and Jerry Dewbre
Hi all,

Good List again today! Keep up those post.

Send your PICS for posting to:


Index to Today's Digest

01  RE: Tumbling
02  RE: ceramic lap troubles
03  RE: Small Stone Facets
04  NEW: facetron dial indicator
05  RE: ceramic lap troubles
06  NEW: stone display
07  RE: ceramic lap troubles
08  RE: How to learn faceting
09  NEW: Off the dop: san carlos arizona peridot
10  NEW: Bowl hold down (facetron)


Subject: RE: Issue No. 188 - Friday August 15, 2003
Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2003 21:29:47 -0400
To: "LapidaryArtsDigest" <lapidary@caprock-spur.com>
From: "Naomi Sarna" <nsarna@earthlink.net>

Thanks all for the interesting and smart suggestions regarding tumbling.
Naomi in New York where we just got electricity after 30 hours.  Another
interesting experience in the big city!


Subject: Re: Issue No. 188 - Friday August 15, 2003
Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2003 19:39:04 -0700
To: LapidaryArtsDigest <lapidary@caprock-spur.com>
From: Noel Rowe <noel@roughtocut.com>

Hi Gene,

Sounds like the diamond hasn't properly dispersed throughout the
carrier. If you have access to an ultrasonic cleaner you might try
putting the bottle in the cleaner (be sure that the top is above the
liquid line) & running the cleaner for 1/2 an hour or so. I mix my own
spray & sometimes the diamond powdered is caked. The ultrasonic does a
good job of dispersing the diamond evenly throughout the liquid. You can
also drop a small ball bearing in the bottle & give it a good shake
before each spray. It helps to keep things mixed well (you'll probably
still need to use the ultrasonic cleaner first though).

> when I switched to a new bottle of 100K spray, large scratches appeared.

Noel Rowe
Rough To Cut


Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2003 00:26:10 -0500
To: LapidaryArtsDigest <lapidary@caprock-spur.com>
From: gembin <gembin@spiff.net>

Hi Charles and All,

Charles W Bell Jr wrote:

>> I mean there are 80,000 ,yes 80,000 diamond cutters 
on the hillsides in INDIA, that facet 58 fullcut SRB s on
sub 1 mm stones. <<

Gee, Charles, I wish I could do that. Years ago I had the vision of a
hawk. However, there is a problem. I have had cataracts removed from
both eyes years ago. I have 1 implant in the left eye and 1 contact lens
in the other. I now have a hole in the macula in my left eye. My right
eye has had an iris problem for years. I don't have a stereo microscope.
I'm afraid I would not be able to see those teeny weenie facets. That's
why I asked if anyone could suggest a cut with fewer facets so each of
them could, in essence, be larger and still have some sparkle. Perhaps
this isn't possible... perhaps it is? I don't know, but I thought I
would ask.

The least facets I can think of is 4 facets. The only way I could
envision a stone with 4 facets would be cut with 3 pavilion main facets
(cut to a point), no girdle and a flat 100% 3 sided polygon table,
resulting in a stone looking much like a pyramid turned upside down,
with the base of the pyramid being the table. I thought this may reflect
light the way the road reflectors you see embedded on highways do. I
guess the best thing to do is cut one to see. I have plenty of small
garnet to experiment with, so that's no problem.

Thanks to each of you that have helped with your suggestions both in the
digest and off-line. I'll try them all, and who knows... perhaps I'll be
lucky and turn out some sparklers if I can see the facets good enough. I
appreciate your replies and think it's great that all your help is out
there just for the asking.

Meanwhile, if any of you out there in facet land have any suggestions
for cutting small stones with less facets and yet sparkle, I'm still
open to suggestions. :-)

Best regards to all,
Doug "Rhodolite" Smith
Alton, Illinois, USA (where we sympathize with those of you that were
caught in the blackout)


Good point Doug, I bet those Indian cutters have very young eyes.



Subject: facetron dial indicator
Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2003 00:05:13 -0600
To: LapidaryArtsDigest <lapidary@caprock-spur.com>
From: gems <gems@direcway.com>

   Has anyone upgraded their Facetron with the new dial indicator. If so
what did you think of it? Was it worth the $300.00 they are asking?


Subject: Ceramic Lap Problems
Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2003 08:43:02 -0700 (PDT)
To: LAPIDARY ARTS & FACETERS DIGEST <faceters@caprock-spur.com>
From: Glenn Klein <glennklein@yahoo.com>

Hi Gene G. and all:
Gene, you mention your problem in polishing stones on your Ceramic lap when you
changed the brand of diamond that you use on the lap.  Not all 100K diamond sprays
are created alike.  I found that Italdo 100K worked best for me.  Every time that I
tried another of the brands I found that it was not really 100K, at least as compared
to the results I had before.
But with the environment changes like in house paint, none are as good as they used
to be.  Even Italdo had to change their carrier in the spray, which is not as good as
it used to be when I first used their product.  However, it remains the best choice
for me.
Be sure to use a Norbide tool to help break down the larger chunks over 100K that may
be in your spray......whatever the brand. 
I could list a couple of brands that I used with results that would not give me a
competition-cut quality polish.....but I do not believe in running a brand down.  I
would rather tell you about the products that work well for me.  I hope you get good
results with one of the sprays.  And when you do find one that works, STICK WITH IT.
Glenn Klein
Lake Forest, CA USA


Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2003 16:28:43 -0400 (Eastern Standard Time)
To: <faceters@caprock-spur.com>
From: "Dennis Demerly" <ddraw@comcast.net>

Hello Thurmond;

There has been talk about manufactures not wanting to be responsible for
their items. I have a problem with a dealer, not the manufacture. The
manufacture came up to the my area to talk to people who had bought
their faceting machine. This dealer only contacted his select group to meet
with the company representative. The faceting  machine is very expensive.
 I heard from one of the people that attended that a lot of good information
was exchanged. This is not the way to keep customers. I was wondering if
anyone else had trouble with the retail dealer?
You can edit this or not even publish it in the Digest. I just found out
this and I am very upset. I would also, like to thank the GREAT people
that try to help other people thru the Digest.



Hi Dennis, I assume that you contacted the dealer and checked into the reason
you were not invited to the manufacturer meeting. If not, it might have been an oversight
or an error in the dealers records. If so, what reason did the dealer give for not including
you in the meeting? What were the requirements or credentials necessary for an invitation?
There must be more to the story. Let us know.


Subject: RE: ceramic lap troubles
Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2003 12:13:40 -0600
To: faceters@caprock-spur.com
From: Michael Williams <mrw23@adelphia.net>

For Gene Goodwin,

You said that "Recently, when I switched to a new bottle of 100K spray,
large scratches appeared..."

It is easy to think you have the knack with a ceramic lap, only to get your
hope and dreams shattered...  I have been in that position before, and one
time it too was when I changed to new diamond.  I can recommend a couple
things that I have found when I run into this problem.

First, it could be the diamond isn't being suspended in the carrier very
well and it's clumping into larger pieces.  You may want to try shaking it
better or getting newer (or different brand) of diamond.  In general, I
think most ceramic lap problems come from too much diamond in the first
place.  I know that's usually true in my case, and what others have told me.

Second, clean your lap with a lint-free towel covered in rubbing
alcohol.  (Even do that with the suggestion above).  When you think you
have it totally clean, start cleaning it again.  Once you have done that
about 3 times, try polishing the stone without having put any diamond on
the lap.  Then, if it needs it, add a very small amount and makes sure that
it is evenly distributed.  What I often do to distribute it is use a
lint-free cloth over 1 finger and run the finger across the lap.  That not
only distributes it, it also seems to keep it from being over-charged with

Anyway, I'm no expert with ceramic laps, but this is what works for me.


Mike Williams
Colorado Springs


Subject: RE: How to learn faceting
Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2003 12:19:01 -0600
To: faceters@caprock-spur.com
From: Michael Williams <mrw23@adelphia.net>

For Jim Taylor,

I know that you have already received several replies, but I have been a
bit too busy to reply until now.  I think that videos are a very good way
to help you to learn faceting.  I have a small collection of faceting
videos that I loan out to people.  I do ask that they return them in a
reasonable time (couple weeks) and pay for the postage both ways.

If you (or anyone else for that matter) are interested in borrowing them,
please let me know off list.


Mike Williams
Colorado Springs


From: "b-daw" <b-daw@pacbell.net>
To: <owner-faceters@caprock-spur.com>
Subject: san carlos arizona peridot
Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2003 12:54:07 -0700

hi thurmond!
i am making my first contribution, so i hope my image isn't too big.  let
me know if i have to shrink it down.
My first large 11mm round, 6.35ct, San Carlos Arizona Peridot.  The
design is called "Spinner" and it was published by John W. Pascal in the
Lapidary Journal of June 1994.



From: "Neil F. Talcott" <neil@wa7bhc.lovelock.nv.us>
To: <owner-lapidary@caprock-spur.com>
Subject: Bowl hold down
Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2003 10:39:28 -0700

Hi to all, especially the Facetron users,

My finger got tired when I cut the girdle facets on my Facetron so a little
work in the shop with about 5 1/2 inches of 1/2 X 1 aluminum bar and some
3/16 brass rod and one 1/4 carriage bolt with a washer that just fits
through the hole on the deck works for me. Pictures help in the explanation,
so there are three attached.
I sent these pictures to Facetron but never heard from them. Thought they
might make an attachment for their machine.
73, Neil  in hot dry Nevada










PERSONALS: (General Lapidary and Faceting)






Lurking is fine, but participation is better for learning !
Post something from your experiences in gemcutting today!


Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2003 19:45:39 -0500
To: ILA Faceter's Digest <faceters@caprock-spur.com>
From: Downey <alckytxn@swbell.net>


It's fun to cook for Bob. Today I made angel food cake. The
recipe said beat 12 eggs separately. The neighbors were nice
enough to loan me some extra bowls.

Bob wanted fruit salad for supper. The recipe said serve
without dressing. So I didn't dress. What a surprise when Bob
brought a friend home for supper.

A good day for rice. The recipe said wash thoroughly
before steaming the rice. It seemed kinda of silly but I took
a bath. I can't say it improved the rice any.

Today Bob asked for salad again. I tried a new recipe. It
said prepare ingredients, then toss on a bed of lettuce one hour
before serving. Which is what led up to Bob asking me why I was
rolling around in the garden.

I found an easy recipe for cookies. It said put all
ingredients in bowl and beat it. There must have been something
wrong with this recipe. When I got back, everything was the same
as when I left.

Bob did the shopping today and brought home a chicken. He
asked me to dress it for Sunday (oh boy). For some reason Bob keeps
counting to ten.

Bob's folks came to dinner. I wanted to serve roast. All
I could find was hamburger. Suddenly I had a flash of genius. I put the
hamburger in the oven and set the controls for roast. It still came out
hamburger, much to my disappointment.

This has been a very exciting week. I am eager for
tomorrow to come so I can try out a new recipe on Bob. If we could just get
a bigger oven, I would like to surprise him with Chocolate Moose



"Do, or do not. There is no 'try'."



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