Issue No. 179 - Friday August 1, 2003
Moderated by: Thurmond Moore III
Committed to carrying on the fine works of
Hale Sweeny and Jerry Dewbre
Hi all,

Keep those post coming in. I need more work. LOL
Have a great weekend.


Index to Today's Digest

01  RE: Cutting oil
02  RE: Cutting oil
03  RE: Cutting oil
04  RE: Jamb Peg Assemblers
05  RE: the Larimar problem
06  RE: Cutting oil
07  RE: Best of Both Worlds? (was Raytech)
08  FS: Wirewrapping
09  NEW: Geology in the News


Subject: Almag
Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2003 15:43:49 -0400
To: <lapidary@caprock-spur.com>
From: "RICHARD P ROSENTHAL" <kenaii@earthlink.net>

Where can I get Almag in less then fifty gallon drums?  I got my Almag
from Fiinkels Hardware in Lambertville N.J. in five gallon plastic
buckets.  I believe it could also be ordered from Gilmans in Helllertown
PA.. If you need phone numbers  or contact information contact me off
list and I will be happy to send it on. kenaii@earthlink.net


Subject: Diala oil
Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2003 21:35:39 +0100
To: <lapidary@caprock-spur.com>
From: "Daniel Hargreaves" <danny@blueyonder.co.uk>

I am a comittee member of the Scottish mineral and Lapidary club. We
used to use diala oil for our rock saws. On cost and ease of use grounds
we now use hydraulic oil. Cuts better and has no additives so less
complaints of itchy skin. It is obtainable in small quantities. Hope
this is of some use.   Danny Hargreaves

>Lately there had been talk on the internet and in Lap[idary Journal
>about the use of one of the new transformer oils (i.e.Shell's Diala AX)
>in rock saws. Formerly the use of transformer oil as a saw coolant was a
>no-no due to the PCB's. But this new oil from Shell has no PCB's as is
>the case with all the new transformer oils, so I've been led to believe.

>The advantage I understand to the use of these light oils is that they
>are cleaner, smell sweeter, etc. than the Al-mag type oils currently
>used. Does anyone have any thing to add to this? Also where can us
>simple rockhounds get less than 55 gallon barrels of the stuff?.
>Roy Meade


Subject: Re: Issue No. 178 - Thursday July 31, 2003
Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2003 17:32:17 -0500
To: "LapidaryArtsDigest" <lapidary@caprock-spur.com>
From: "Grady" <grady3@cox.net>


I am relatively new to this hobby as well, and this is my first post. I too
was on a quest for a non solvent based cutting oil, and checked with many
local oil companies for the Pella or Almag oils. Everything I found could be
had in 5 gallon buckets from the oil distributors. However, keep in mind
that these lightweight transformer oils are designed as coolants only.
Transformers have no moving parts that need lubrication. I went to a local
veterinary supply house and bought mineral oil that is given to horses for
colic. I  did not want to buy 5 gallons only not to be satisfied with what I
bought. The mineral oil works great in my 10 inch saw as a coolant and
lubricant, and I paid $13 for a gallon of it. Since it is near
pharmaceutical grade, I would think that it would have no ill effects if it
was handled. Can this be said of the transformer oils? One would have to
read the MSDS sheets. The only gripe I really have, and I am sure it would
apply to any oil, is the misting. I have heard that there are additives to
be had that cut down on the misting, but have not stumbled across it yet. If
you go with the transformer oil, please let me know the details- brand,
minimum amount you could buy, cost, size of your saw, material being cut,
and how well you liked it.



Subject: Re: Issue No. 171 - Tuesday July 22, 2003
Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2003 20:41:54 -0700
To: LapidaryArtsDigest <lapidary@caprock-spur.com>
From: John McLaughlin <jemstone@amug.org>

Hi Thurmond,

I am relieved to hear that Mr. Wykoff is well.  I am less excited to
hear that his new machine will require a 12 year old to assemble it.  I
have been having to rely on that age group to keep my computer up to
date and to fix the problems I create.  Now even a new faceting machine
will require a 12 year old to set it up.  Bummer.

John McLaughlin
Glendale, Arizona

>Just a note to let those interested know Jerry Wykoff is well and will be
introducing his patented Calibrated Jamb Peg machine in an all metal kit that can
be assembled  in about 1/2 hour by a 12 year old . He said he is waiting on the
final castings.
>I will let the list know more details as they are available.


Subject: RE: the Larimar problem
Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2003 23:51:44 -0600
To: <lapidary@caprock-spur.com>
From: "jake" <efjke@msn.com>

To Glenn Warr, the Larimar problem,

  I too have had problems with some stones.  You have been at this longer
than I have, so I am not the expert and not knowing what you are using I can
only relate what my experience has been.  I have had this problem with
turquoise and some other stone.  I will assume you are using carbide wheels,
I will say to skip the first one you usually use for even forming it.  If
the wheel is not perfect it will smack your stone and on some material this
apparently sets up micro fractures that can later cause problems even when
sanding. You can check this by feeling the wheel lightly if there are any
bumps (at all) this is the problem.  On some jasper it will have a grain and
if not cut with this it can spald, I have seen a reference to labadorite
regarding this although I only cut one piece where this was a problem.

  Morenci Stone Works gave me advice on cutting their turquoise, several
years back.  It was recommended on the high matrix material to use
diamond-sanding belts with as little water as you can get by with, as there
is a tendency on some of it to rip the matrix out when using a wheel,
something you don't want.

"Very experienced cutter that knows how to back a slice and prep Morenci so
that it shows great matrix, and stays together, for that they know how to
not to get it too wet, new blades, type of belt or diamond wheel, which
sometimes a 100 grit diamond wheel will shatter the piece.  I use only belts
and they are worn down, so the bite is not going to rip out the matrix etc."
Wayne Brown

  Most problems I have had were with stone that had metal in them, such as
turquoise, this type can be brittle, hence easy for chipping to occur if
started on a 120 or so wheel.  Although I have not cut Larimar, I understand
this sometime has pyrite in it, and might have the same problem. But notice
the comment about a "100 grit diamond wheel can shatter the piece," I have
had this happen on a carbide wheel, while not all turquoise has this
problem, it can happen and I suspect the Larimar has this tendency.

  Although that is a different stone some of what I said might apply, as I
have noticed it dose on some other rock I have cut in regards to the
tendency to want to chip or spald.  If you are using diamond I am at a loss
of what to say, only try, if you haven't already, using a higher grit wheel
to start with and take your time. I hope this may lessen the problem.

E. Jakeman
Ogden, Utah


Subject: Re:cutting oil
Date: Fri, 1 Aug 2003 02:29:23 EDT
To: lapidary@caprock-spur.com
From: Criss1128@aol.com

        As the author of the article that appeared in Rock and Gem Magazine,
(not LJ) I thought I'd respond to your post about using transformer oil.
 About a month after the article was published, one of the Shell
representatives that I'd spoken with about Diala AX transformer oil, called me
and told me
that Shell was going to cease production of Diala AX in the near future in an
effort to streamline their product line. It must not have been one of their
more profitable products. I sure wish I'd known this before I wrote the
article, but that's the way it goes sometime I guess.
 So, if anyone is contemplating trying out Diala AX, you need to do it soon,
before production of it is stopped. I have a 55 gallon drum of the stuff, and
it will most likely last me the rest of my life, if I reuse it after the
sludge settles.
 As far as the issue of buying in smaller amounts than a 55 gallon barrel
goes, it all depends on the distributor, whether or not he will sell in smaller
quantities. I was told that there's a problem with the oil absorbing moisture
from the air, that makes it unacceptable for use as transformer oil, when a
large container of it is opened repeatedly. I don't know whether or not this is
true, but that's one answer I got while searching for distributors who will
sell in smaller amounts than a barrel. This obviously isn't a problem for
lapidary use, but in a large transformer with thousands of volts running through
moisture is not something you'd want.
 One thing you might want to try is to write Shell. There's a link to contact
them on their <A HREF="www.shell.com">www.shell.com</A> website. Hopefully they
can help.
 I don't know when Shell plans to stop making Diala AX, but if you want to
try it out, now's the time to do it. I know for sure that I like this oil more
than any other I've ever tried, and maybe you will too.
                 Criss Morgan


Subject: Re: Best of Both Worlds?
Date: Fri, 1 Aug 2003 16:15:48 +0200
To: lapidary@caprock-spur.com (LapidaryArtsDigest)
From: Tom Herbst <herbst@mpia-hd.mpg.de>

On Thursday, July 31, 2003, at 08:38 PM, Gearloose aka zircon wrote:

> So on my own, I was building mast types
> for myself because it seemed an intuitively obvious way of doing it. 
> While
> I see the advantage of being able to pick up the entire assembly to
> leisurely and comfortably examine the stone, ...

I came across an interesting machine that may represent the best of
both mast and platform worlds. I have posted some pictures at:


Best wishes,

Tom Herbst
Heidelberg Germany


Subject: Wirewrapping
Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2003 18:25:40 -0400
To: <lapidary@caprock-spur.com>
From: "roy meade" <roydot@bellsouth.net>

Besides being a faceter, I am a professional wirewrapper(15 YEARS) doing
20 shows per year in the southeastern US, from Hilton Head,SC to Ft
Wayne,IN. I make rings, earrings, bracelets, pendants. amd pins, using
youre stone or mine. I use 14ktgf, and sterling silver. (I can use 14 kt
on special order.)
R & D Traders
Roy Meade


Subject: Geology in the News
Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2003 23:49:19 -0500
From: Downey <alckytxn@swbell.net>










PERSONALS: (General Lapidary and Faceting)






Lurking is fine, but participation is better for learning !
Post something from your experiences in gemcutting today!



Subject: [Fwd: Job application]
Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2003 22:33:44 -0500
To: IFA Faceter's Digest <faceters@caprock-spur.com>
From: Downey <alckytxn@swbell.net>

Next time your application for a job is rejected...

Dear [Interviewer's Name]:

Thank you for your letter of [Date of Interview]. After
careful consideration I regret to inform you that I am
unable to accept your refusal to offer me employment with
your firm. This year I have had been particularly fortunate
in receiving an unusually large number of rejection letters.
With such a varied and promising field of candidates it is
impossible for me to accept all refusals.

Despite [Firm's Name]'s outstanding qualifications and pre-
vious experience in rejecting applicants, I find that your
rejection does not meet with my needs at this time. There-
fore, I will initiate employment with your firm immediately
following graduation. I look forward to seeing you then.

Best of luck in rejecting future candidates.

Sincerely, [Your Name]



"In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice.
But, in practice, there is."

---Jan L.A. van de Snepscheut---


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Tempie Francis, Attorney at Law / Legal Advisor


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